Mike, are you going to do a post on the extreme weather Russia is currently experiencing? Not as photogenic as a picture from space, but very much an issue for the people experiencing it.
What extreme weather in Moscow,Eric? Temperatures have been above average across western Russia/eastern Europe for end November into December. That heavy snow would suggest mid-upper atmosphere warmth is up a little for this time of year. Extreme cold suppresses snowfall potential.
And that sustained warmth is a co-effect of blocking which enhanced cold over the Baltic. The same week saw above average temps across most of the US.
Meanwhile, Moscow’s long-term data show a clear rising trend in annual average temperature.
Once again,you didn’t read my comment. ‘Warm’ weather–warmer than usual for that time of year– contributed to the record snowfall. Atmospheric warmth means more potential moisture. In winter that can mean more snow until temps move above freezing.
The worst November snow in 50 years was about 10-20cm…which demonstrates how cold and dry Moscow is in winter–in fact the average annual precipitation is about 700mm with around 250mm available for the snowy months. They don’t get much snow,but because winter is cold they usually keep what they get for a while–though lately winters have been well down on snow.
In a nutshell your response shows why you are out of your depth : if you cannot deal with the occasional counter-intuitive scenario then you will not learn much about meteorology and you will remain hopelessly confused about climate. But you’re smug enough to think the confusion lies elsewhere,and certain that snow ruining the Moscow commute for a day means something or other about the world..
They [Moscow} have been down on snow DURATION because what falls is more likely to melt than before. Snow is just the frozen form of water,Eric. Moscow is not getting drier in winter. In fact there is a slight trend in increasing winter precipitation according to meteoinfo.ru….
Trenberth and others frequently point to greater atmospheric moisture POTENTIAL—potential,meaning possible moisture content if meteorology lines up to deliver it–in net warmer atmospheres. This is basic physics. Snow events in Moscow have the potential to be individually heavier than in the slightly colder slightly drier past. But the truncating cold winter autumn means that a potential for slightly heavier snow events may not translate into as much accumulation and persistence of snow cover as in the cooler past. A warmer Moscow will see perhaps fewer snow events but more of those will be relatively heavy in local context. And there will be more rain events as a percentage of winter precipitation events.
Do you see how you can arrive at an increase in winter precipitation, a decline in snow events, an increase in average snowfall per snow event and yet a decrease in duration of snow cover? Of course,average snow per event may not have changed measurably or at all and it may just be down to warmer winters and autumns alone for the decline in snow duration. You’ll have to look into it. But I doubt you’re really interested in climate in any dispassionate way.
‘Recent heavy snow fall in the northern hemisphere’? Could be anywhere over half the planet!
Consider: Firstly the heavy snow event was actually only heavy in local context. Secondly,it was a regional short duration event with a local extreme. Thirdly November across north western Russia and eastern Scandinavia was anomalously warm,2C and more than average,yet a fair bit of that area was more snowy [greater number than average snow cover days] than usual. So warmer can equal more snow,eh? Looking in more detail at Rutgers daily snow data, you can see that late October early November was anomalously snowy over that area but the last half of the month was anomalously lacking snow settling days. This suggests anomalous cold followed by even more anomalous warmth to net as a monthly surplus.
The really interesting place has been [as you mentioned] northern China and eastern Mongolia ,where there has been much more snow duration than typical for much of November..but we have the [relatively] warm Arctic to blame for that. And there has been much less snow cover than average across Tibet [drier] and southern Russia and Europe [warmer] than usual.And the US waits for winter most of November was short of snow cover average] while western Canada is already well snowy.
Do they ever have average months or seasons up there? Perhaps not.
The long term data for Eurasia shows winter snow cover trending slightly up [warmer,moister winters in a cold area =more snow potential] but declines in spring and autumn seasonal average areas..
I remember when your heroes were predicting ski resorts would go out of business. They blow in the breeze – any anomalous weather becomes supporting evidence for their theory.
Just ask yourself whether a reduction in snowfall would be accepted as evidence the world was cooling, to see how silly you sound.
Well you’ve just tried to recruit anomalous weather to support YOUR theory….failing as usual though. The balance of extremes is heavily on the warming/melting/thawing side. Even where local warming has seen an increase in precipitation as snowfall which has turned out to be insufficient to overwhelm the strength of the warming as it continues.
In Australia,resort operators have invested very heavily in extensive snow making networks which they run whenever possible on cold dry nights…they consulted the experts, read the projections, and most notably they LOOKED AT THE BLOODY OBSERVATIONS!!! Winter snow pack max depth and duration trend is down over 60 years of continuous data, and you will find no one and no data to contradict that FACT. Do you think resort operators are stupid?
Your ‘just ask yourself’ is a joke,surely? If the world got dramatically cooler,yes,snowfall quantity would decline because cold air holds less moisture. But what snow did fall would endure longer,giving the illusion of more snowiness…What do you learn from Antarctica? It’s a super cold desert.The snowiest–as in heaviest precipitation in the form of snow– places are not the coldest. They are the best combination of wet and cold. They are closer to reliably moist air, are mountainous and intercept prevailing moist cool winds. Think St Elias Mountains, or the western side of the NZ Alps. In the case of St Elias Mountains,they have sufficient elevation to see an increase in snowfall at the highest levels while temperature increases a little but will cross a threshhold where further temp rise will see melting outweigh snow retention/ice gain. It’s already happening depending on elevation. The lower ends of the glaciers are in retreat,and the glacier thickness is declining while at highest altitudes the glaciers may even gain a little mass.
Mt Baker,the worlds snowiest ski resort is perfectly positioned to see Pacific moisture coincide with continental and Canadian cold,producing a huge average snowfall. Its glaciers are in retreat all the same. This well studied peak has shown the temperature/moisture relationship in all its phases: a cooling with an increase in snowfall saw glaciers advance from the 50s to the 70s then a warming and drying saw retreat to the 90s…now precipitation has again increased but retreat continues because temperature increase is trumping the greater moisture potential of warming.
Another example: Mt Blanc above 4200m is known to be seeing more precipitation and gaining snow mass…while below 4000m the glacier surface is falling and the ends are in retreat. IOW,the equilibrium line–the point governed where accumulation balances loss is retreating uphill. That trumps extra snowfall in that instance. In most case in the Alps the equilibrium line has gone so high that the glaciers are set to waste away.
Back to Moscow with its borderline semi-arid continental climate: they could well see enhanced moisture and enhanced temperature reshape the graph. A shorter duration of snowpack with fewer but proportionally heavier snowfalls..for a few decades.Then the effects of further warming would completely dominate snowfall potential and snowlying would be transient.
You misunderstand Nick. I’m not using cold weather to push global cooling, I’m poking fun at you guys seizing on to every anomaly as evidence for your beliefs.
The temperature isn’t actually rising though, is it?
I know you guys are flailing around, trying to find excuses, with spurious claims of heat being swallowed by the ocean depths, Chinese particulates, or heat being absorbed by other phenomenon, but its more than a little embarrassing that the thermometers aren’t budging – especially in the light of the 2008 NOAA State of the Climate report I’ve quoted several times which suggests that this is inconsistent with projections.
So prediction time – when will all this alleged absorbed warming reappear? Because if it never reappears, it might as well not exist.
Ah Eric has found one sentence from one report 4 years ago to declare models falsified and temperatures are no longer rising. That is very weak even by your standards. Let’s see, since 1997 RSS is flat and the other three are rising. Who’s flailing about again? Rahmstorf et al 2012 looks at the the signals….Eric ducks.
forgot, local sunshine coast daily had an editorial devoted to climate change,
Have noticed a complete reversal in the past few months since the god botherer editor left. this is the second piece this week advocating action to combat climate change.
The Republicans think that anyone who disagrees with them is a communist. So they are very vulnerable to unctuous charlatans like Monckton who can play them like violins.
noticed this bit from monckton designed to pull the suckers in
” Yet the least-squares linear-regression trend on the Hadley Centre/CRU dataset favoured by the IPCC indeed shows no statistically-significant warming for 16 years. ”
notice “favoured”
but the suckers read that as though the IPCC uses CRU.for global world temp
Hadley does not record the full global temp data, they only record arctic stns but assumae that the rest of the arctic is warming at the global rate,
GISS also does not record the total global temp but assumes that the arctic is only warming as fast as the nearest stns
The Arctic is the fastest warming area of the planet .
global warming does not reside in record years is resides in trends
even the CRU trend since 2000 is 0.13DegC
The warming continues, Monckton is a fool
In the letter they call themselves scientists, Monckton is forced by fact to now speak of researchers instead,
John :
05 Dec 2012 9:02:23am
john byatt, James E.Hansen of NASA/GISS has confessed that his data are smoothed and adjusted before release, but he will not, and has not been compelled to, tell us what his raw data show.
On the other hand, the UK Met Office, by dint of legal threat and threat of FOI request, HAS been forced to release unadulterated figures.
They prove that the globe has actually COOLED over the last 16 years.
Alert moderator
antichinus :
05 Dec 2012 9:26:11am
Cow excrement and flying pigs.
Data has to be adjusted, but not because it is being fudged!
Hilarious – more climate delegates exposed as ignorant simpletons. I guess after 2 (3?) conferences of doing the dihydrogen monoxide joke, they were forewarned, so this time we tried something else.
eight interviewed originally, only six said they would wear the mask, how many days did they spend asking people to find those six? they were students and social science people
did you see the others snicker,
once again eric you have been scammed
Oh and there are a lot of others there only allowed to attend for three days each, students and social researchers, they are all gone before the serious discussions begin,
You have been suckered in again , watts makes the allegation and links to michaels making the same allegation , no link to the Hansen piece at all,
If you want credibility link to Hansen piece and highlight the call for a dictatorship, also the highlight the call to invade Canada,
Do you understand that you are hallucinating and need medication?
Fossil fuel interests reign in Washington and other capitals. Big money forces legislatures to hatch ineffectual schemes such as “cap-and-trade-with-offsets”, a system designed by big banks.
Is there any hope, if most nations delude themselves with greenwash, of stopping rule by fossil fuel interests? Yes, China is the best hope. China now leads the world in clean energy investments – nuclear, wind, and solar power.
In other words, in Hansen’s world, western democracy has failed, because it has been bought by big oil, and only dictatorships like China can save the world.
And I already gave my quote for Hansen demanding America “do something” to stop Canada exploiting its tar sands. At the very least he’s advocating cultural imperialism – using America’s economic and global political might to put pressure on Canada.
John, you have exposed Eric for what he is – a pathetic sad liar, trolling in the hope of human contact. The psychopathology of this guy is very disturbing (especially his fixation on Nazism and Eugenics)
As I said above, Hansen praised the Chinese system as being our best hope, because Western democracy has failed (has been bought by big oil). He’s not explicitly saying “Western Democracy should be replaced by a Chinese dictatorship”, but he is saying that the Chinese dictatorship is better at addressing climate issues.
Given that Hansen thinks we’re all going to die unless we stop the death trains, that’s as close as you can get to calling for a dictatorship while being too much of a coward to actually say it.
Post the quotes from hansen where he calls for a dictatorship and calls to invade Canada, also post the 2008 Noaa quote that the global temp has not warmed for fifteen years
Fossil fuel interests reign in Washington and other capitals. Big money forces legislatures to hatch ineffectual schemes such as “cap-and-trade-with-offsets”, a system designed by big banks.
Is there any hope, if most nations delude themselves with greenwash, of stopping rule by fossil fuel interests? Yes, China is the best hope. China now leads the world in clean energy investments – nuclear, wind, and solar power.
In other words, in Hansen’s world, western democracy has failed, because it has been bought by big oil, and only dictatorships like China can save the world.
And I already gave my quote for Hansen demanding America “do something” to stop Canada exploiting its tar sands. At the very least he’s advocating cultural imperialism – using America’s economic and global political might to put pressure on Canada.
I see – so in your bizarro world, claiming western democracy has failed because Washington has been bought by big oil, and that China is the hope for the world, is not the same calling for dictatorship to solve our problems?
Sexism too – she disagrees with you, so she’s subhuman in some way, and doesn’t deserve the normal respect you would give to a woman? The word you are looking for is “untermensch”.
It usually snows at least once or twice in most years in the OZ Alps in summer. I experienced an Xmas night fall in the 1970s.
While that cold front was squeezing in down south,northern NSW and much of Queensland was anomalously warm with several temperature records broken,including serious ones like consecutive number of degree days and the like .Mount Isa saw the November average maximum 2.6C degrees above average,13 days over 40C and the first four days of December have been over 40 as well. 95% of Queensland and NSW has been anomalously warm for November by one to four degrees celsius.
And you’ve found a dash of snow for one morning in NE Vic and the highest peaks of Australia…no comparison really.
I posted the link for the Hansen “putting pressure on Canada” with my comment. Obviously I was being a little satirical, but Hansen is clearly suggesting America “must not let Canada” exploit the tar sands. An invasion is pretty much the only way America could achieve this.
I posted the link to the article where Hansen calls for the Chinese dictatorship to solve our problems.
FFS, Western democracy has failed, China is our hope for the future, is *not* a call for dictatorship?
No I do not want your satiracal interpretation I want the quote to put up as your evidence that hansens calls for an ivasion of canada, just put the quote itself up eric, it’s an easy
Okay most will work out that you have a bit of a comprehension problem with that one now the invasion of Canada one,
then we will put them all together
The linear trend from August 1997 (in the middle of an exceptionally strong El Nino) to August 2012 (coming at the tail end of a double-dip La Nina) is about 0.03°C/decade, amounting to a temperature increase of 0.05°C over that period, but equally we could calculate the linear trend from 1999, during the subsequent La Nina, and show a more substantial warming.
0.05c = flatline.
Its going to be amusing watching you guys squirm as the flatline continues. The next deadline is Ben Santer’s 17 year minimum significance for a climate trend.
Right, so the basis for your claim that temperatures have not gone up is that temperatures have gone up? Well, hey, half of WUWT’s commentariat thinks we’ve plunged into an ice age, so I guess you’re ahead of the curve.
According to alarmist theory, temperatures should have risen by about 0.3c.
The rise in temperature, if there actually has been a rise, is far less than 0.3c – even using GISS temperatures maintained by climate fanatic James Hansen (who has been arrested at least twice for climate activism, and has a long track record of hyped up predictions).
The linear trend from August 1997 (in the middle of an exceptionally strong El Nino) to August 2012 (coming at the tail end of a double-dip La Nina) is about 0.03°C/decade, amounting to a temperature increase of 0.05°C over that period, but equally we could calculate the linear trend from 1999, during the subsequent La Nina, and show a more substantial warming.
You’ve just posted the METoffice’s explanation of how people like you can and do cherry pick a flat line [start from the strongest El Nino on record]. The irony is rich the real context of the statement completely eludes you. Amazing.
The linear trend from August 1997 (in the middle of an exceptionally strong El Nino) to August 2012 (coming at the tail end of a double-dip La Nina) is about 0.03°C/decade, amounting to a temperature increase of 0.05°C over that period, but equally we could calculate the linear trend from 1999, during the subsequent La Nina, and show a more substantial warming.
The MET office has advanced an explanation of why they think the flatline is consistent with alarmist theory.
WRONG!!!</b.
The MET office was explaining how you can get a flat line by choosing your start and end points, just the way the people you copied did it.
How on earth did you write an app? You have absolutely no grasp of logical thinking. I can only assume the app is as crappy as your arguments here.
Fossil fuel interests reign in Washington and other capitals. Big money forces legislatures to hatch ineffectual schemes such as “cap-and-trade-with-offsets”, a system designed by big banks.
Is there any hope, if most nations delude themselves with greenwash, of stopping rule by fossil fuel interests? Yes, China is the best hope. China now leads the world in clean energy investments – nuclear, wind, and solar power.
Hansen calls for a dictatorship
Fossil fuel interests reign in Washington and other capitals. Big money forces legislatures to hatch ineffectual schemes such as “cap-and-trade-with-offsets”, a system designed by big banks.
Is there any hope, if most nations delude themselves with greenwash, of stopping rule by fossil fuel interests? Yes, China is the best hope. China now leads the world in clean energy investments – nuclear, wind, and solar power.
Hansen calls to invade canada
President Obama has the power not only to deny tar sands oil additional access to Gulf Coast refining, which Canada desires in part for export markets, but also to encourage economic incentives to leave tar sands and other dirty fuels in the ground.
NOAA uses the GHCN which uses GISS, which shows the warming continuing,
Eric thinks that they should use the data which he selects
1. If GISS and NOAA temperatures differ to that degree, which it seems they do, then the error margin for global temperatures means current trends are indistinguishable from a flatline.
2. Fossil fuel interests rule Washington and other capitals … China is the best hope.
Only the purity of dictatorship can fend off big oil? Or did he mean something else? Interested in your take John.
3. resident Obama has the power not only to deny tar sands oil additional access to Gulf Coast refining, which Canada desires in part for export markets, but also to encourage economic incentives to leave tar sands and other dirty fuels in the ground.
Hansen is advocating America bully Canada into changing policy. What if economic incentives fail (as they clearly are – if Obama vetoes Keystone, Canada has already said they’ll just step up sales to China)? What is the next move?
Hansen is advocating America bully Canada into changing policy. What if economic incentives fail (as they clearly are – if Obama vetoes Keystone, Canada has already said they’ll just step up sales to China)? What is the next move?
you have just crossed the line, I will not comment with you further
why
“President Obama has the power not only to deny tar sands oil additional access to Gulf Coast refining, which Canada desires in part for export markets, but also to encourage economic incentives to leave tar sands and other dirty fuels in the ground.”
You continually show yourself to be mentally deficient .
President Obama has the power not only to deny tar sands oil additional access to Gulf Coast refining, which Canada desires in part for export markets, but also to encourage economic incentives to leave tar sands and other dirty fuels in the ground.
On what planet is that not bullying? You might believe it justified, but it is still advocacy of coercion to try to force Canada to change their policy.
The more than 500 dead or missing in Bopha was still below the 1,200 deaths from tropical storm Washi, which hit in December 2011, leaving hundreds of thousands homeless in Mindanao, he said.
Aquino said the government was investigating why an army patrol base in New Bataan, which was washed away in the flash floods, had been located in a flood-prone area.
Officials were also checking reports that an evacuation centre there was among the structures wiped out in the floods, the president added.
“According to (survivors), there is a small lake on the mountain that gave way so the waters flowed down, not just along the rivers… but all across, like a waterfall, bringing a slurry that covered the whole town,” Roxas said.
One shelter there had caved in during the typhoon, forcing the people inside to flee to an even smaller building, he said.
Bopha was the most powerful of the 16 storms to pummel the Philippines this year, though Mindanao is not usually on the front line.
Regional military spokesman Lieutenant Colonel Paniza said three soldiers taking part in rescue operations were killed in New Bataan, with eight others from the same unit among the missing.
“It is quite sad and tragic. They were actually there to be ready to help our countrymen who may be in trouble,” Roxas said.
Pants on Fire Eric thinks it is funny that people are dying in the Philippines. How low as a person do you have to sink to laugh at people who are dying? As you have a fixation on Nazism and Eugenics I suppose I should not be surprised about you hatred of humanity.
Hilarious – your doomsday cult is suffering from large numbers of people paying it lip service.
Just as in religious societies, a lot of people got to church on Sunday because its the custom, rather than a burning desire to listen to the priest and think about God, so in our society people now give perfunctory genuflection to tales of future climate disaster, but don’t care enough to change their lives, or demand real action.
What other explanation can you have, for surveys in which a lot of people say they are worried, but elections in which other issues take priority?
If I truly, in my heart, thought the world would end next Friday unless I did something, I would do something. But people aren’t “doing something” – they don’t really care.
Got a question that you guys might be able to answer.
Given that China is now, by far, the largest CO2 emitter in the world, and at just under 10% increase p/a is contributing the lions share of human CO2 emissions growth,
When are you guys going to stage an “occupy China” protest?
Well we couldn’t “Occupy China” – I suspect the Chinese would see that as an act or war and respond accordingly.
But yes it is true, China is one of the world’s largest emitters.
In my view, the United States and China need to come to an agreement. However the perceived national self interest of both these nations won’t allow that (at this stage at least).
It most certainly is a form of prisoner’s dilemma. Any economy which tries to unilaterally limit carbon emissions, by raising domestic energy prices, is committing economic suicide – competitors can relax, and rely on their lower structural costs to push the carbon limiting economy out of the market.
The only “solution” which could possibly allow a country to unilaterally decarbonise, without a dramatic increase in energy costs, is nuclear power. Renewables are an expensive waste of time. And even nuclear might cost too much – from memory nuclear power costs about twice as much as electricity generated from fracked gas.
You’re not going to protest against China, because you only go for soft targets and easy wins. Or maybe because Hansen thinks they are cool, despite the fact they now contribute the lions share of CO2 output and CO2 output growth.
Soft targets like climate scientists? Your neofascist goon mates have been threatening scientists for years now. Big brave Eric, his mates sending death threats to scientists. Well done champ. Your kids would be sooo proud.
When morons like you invest so much time in those emails it just shows how desperate you are to ignore reality. Back you your animal porn and alien gamma ray communications…
What do your alien gamma ray overlords tell you Pants…to post here where everybody thinks you re a first class wanker? You must be a really sad and lonely denier. And let me know who you are working for at the moment. I’d love to have a chat to them about your antics.
I was wondering when you would notice the methane losses from the switch to the gas economy. Maybe you’d be better off encouraging them to burn coal.
In any case, my experience in England shows that, as energy costs rise, due to enforced green tariffs or whatever, people switch en masse to burning coal at home.
Its easy to laugh at Europeans, caught between freezing winters and their mistaken belief in dangerous climate change. But your fellow travellers should take some of the blame – if Europeans had not listened to climate alarmists, they wouldn’t be in their current pickle.
Its just posturing. The US has a blowout budget deficit and a total debt of $16 trillion and rising. They simply cannot afford any form of transfer payments beyond a little window dressing. Obama just wants the Republicans to be the bad guys, by letting the Republican Congress kill any agreement.
Or maybe he plans to run the printing presses, and print the money he plans to ship overseas?
Monckton makes one interesting point – any defendant in a case brought against them due to a law signed by Obama, now or in the future, could conceivably challenge the legitimacy of the law, by asserting Obama’s presidency is illegitimate, and demand to inspect the president’s original birth certificate.
Watching the Deniers 
Terrific weather picture.
Heartless turd.
Froggie froggie…
Typhoon Bopha is very worrying for those of us who have relatives in Mindanao..
Not good
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-12-05/an-phillipines-typhoon-toll-rises/4409418
Mike, are you going to do a post on the extreme weather Russia is currently experiencing? Not as photogenic as a picture from space, but very much an issue for the people experiencing it.
http://ruvr.co.uk/2012_12_04/Snowstorm-traffic-chaos-Moscow-roads/
And I guess you could count Northern Sweden and NE China as areas currently affected by severe weather as well.
here you can report it
http://www.weather.com/weather/tenday/Moscow+Russia+RSXX0063
The highlight
Cold and Snow Will Return
After a stretch of record warmth, cold and, yes, even snow, will return to parts of the country starting late this week.
What extreme weather in Moscow,Eric? Temperatures have been above average across western Russia/eastern Europe for end November into December. That heavy snow would suggest mid-upper atmosphere warmth is up a little for this time of year. Extreme cold suppresses snowfall potential.
And that sustained warmth is a co-effect of blocking which enhanced cold over the Baltic. The same week saw above average temps across most of the US.
Meanwhile, Moscow’s long-term data show a clear rising trend in annual average temperature.
It was reported as the worst snow in 50 years. But I forgot sorry, only warm weather contributes towards climate.
http://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/moscow-photos-biggest-november/2171538
Once again,you didn’t read my comment. ‘Warm’ weather–warmer than usual for that time of year– contributed to the record snowfall. Atmospheric warmth means more potential moisture. In winter that can mean more snow until temps move above freezing.
The worst November snow in 50 years was about 10-20cm…which demonstrates how cold and dry Moscow is in winter–in fact the average annual precipitation is about 700mm with around 250mm available for the snowy months. They don’t get much snow,but because winter is cold they usually keep what they get for a while–though lately winters have been well down on snow.
Thats got to be one of the most confused replies I’ve ever seen you write.
Lately they’ve been well down on snow, because its getting warmer, which causes more snowfall.
Have to add it to the list, though I’m not sure what category.
http://www.numberwatch.co.uk/warmlist.htm
In a nutshell your response shows why you are out of your depth : if you cannot deal with the occasional counter-intuitive scenario then you will not learn much about meteorology and you will remain hopelessly confused about climate. But you’re smug enough to think the confusion lies elsewhere,and certain that snow ruining the Moscow commute for a day means something or other about the world..
They [Moscow} have been down on snow DURATION because what falls is more likely to melt than before. Snow is just the frozen form of water,Eric. Moscow is not getting drier in winter. In fact there is a slight trend in increasing winter precipitation according to meteoinfo.ru….
Trenberth and others frequently point to greater atmospheric moisture POTENTIAL—potential,meaning possible moisture content if meteorology lines up to deliver it–in net warmer atmospheres. This is basic physics. Snow events in Moscow have the potential to be individually heavier than in the slightly colder slightly drier past. But the truncating cold winter autumn means that a potential for slightly heavier snow events may not translate into as much accumulation and persistence of snow cover as in the cooler past. A warmer Moscow will see perhaps fewer snow events but more of those will be relatively heavy in local context. And there will be more rain events as a percentage of winter precipitation events.
Do you see how you can arrive at an increase in winter precipitation, a decline in snow events, an increase in average snowfall per snow event and yet a decrease in duration of snow cover? Of course,average snow per event may not have changed measurably or at all and it may just be down to warmer winters and autumns alone for the decline in snow duration. You’ll have to look into it. But I doubt you’re really interested in climate in any dispassionate way.
Sounds to me like a rather desperate attempt to explain away recent heavy snow fall in the Northern Hemisphere Nick. But its fun to watch.
‘Recent heavy snow fall in the northern hemisphere’? Could be anywhere over half the planet!
Consider: Firstly the heavy snow event was actually only heavy in local context. Secondly,it was a regional short duration event with a local extreme. Thirdly November across north western Russia and eastern Scandinavia was anomalously warm,2C and more than average,yet a fair bit of that area was more snowy [greater number than average snow cover days] than usual. So warmer can equal more snow,eh? Looking in more detail at Rutgers daily snow data, you can see that late October early November was anomalously snowy over that area but the last half of the month was anomalously lacking snow settling days. This suggests anomalous cold followed by even more anomalous warmth to net as a monthly surplus.
The really interesting place has been [as you mentioned] northern China and eastern Mongolia ,where there has been much more snow duration than typical for much of November..but we have the [relatively] warm Arctic to blame for that. And there has been much less snow cover than average across Tibet [drier] and southern Russia and Europe [warmer] than usual.And the US waits for winter most of November was short of snow cover average] while western Canada is already well snowy.
Do they ever have average months or seasons up there? Perhaps not.
The long term data for Eurasia shows winter snow cover trending slightly up [warmer,moister winters in a cold area =more snow potential] but declines in spring and autumn seasonal average areas..
I remember when your heroes were predicting ski resorts would go out of business. They blow in the breeze – any anomalous weather becomes supporting evidence for their theory.
Just ask yourself whether a reduction in snowfall would be accepted as evidence the world was cooling, to see how silly you sound.
Well you’ve just tried to recruit anomalous weather to support YOUR theory….failing as usual though. The balance of extremes is heavily on the warming/melting/thawing side. Even where local warming has seen an increase in precipitation as snowfall which has turned out to be insufficient to overwhelm the strength of the warming as it continues.
In Australia,resort operators have invested very heavily in extensive snow making networks which they run whenever possible on cold dry nights…they consulted the experts, read the projections, and most notably they LOOKED AT THE BLOODY OBSERVATIONS!!! Winter snow pack max depth and duration trend is down over 60 years of continuous data, and you will find no one and no data to contradict that FACT. Do you think resort operators are stupid?
Your ‘just ask yourself’ is a joke,surely? If the world got dramatically cooler,yes,snowfall quantity would decline because cold air holds less moisture. But what snow did fall would endure longer,giving the illusion of more snowiness…What do you learn from Antarctica? It’s a super cold desert.The snowiest–as in heaviest precipitation in the form of snow– places are not the coldest. They are the best combination of wet and cold. They are closer to reliably moist air, are mountainous and intercept prevailing moist cool winds. Think St Elias Mountains, or the western side of the NZ Alps. In the case of St Elias Mountains,they have sufficient elevation to see an increase in snowfall at the highest levels while temperature increases a little but will cross a threshhold where further temp rise will see melting outweigh snow retention/ice gain. It’s already happening depending on elevation. The lower ends of the glaciers are in retreat,and the glacier thickness is declining while at highest altitudes the glaciers may even gain a little mass.
Mt Baker,the worlds snowiest ski resort is perfectly positioned to see Pacific moisture coincide with continental and Canadian cold,producing a huge average snowfall. Its glaciers are in retreat all the same. This well studied peak has shown the temperature/moisture relationship in all its phases: a cooling with an increase in snowfall saw glaciers advance from the 50s to the 70s then a warming and drying saw retreat to the 90s…now precipitation has again increased but retreat continues because temperature increase is trumping the greater moisture potential of warming.
Another example: Mt Blanc above 4200m is known to be seeing more precipitation and gaining snow mass…while below 4000m the glacier surface is falling and the ends are in retreat. IOW,the equilibrium line–the point governed where accumulation balances loss is retreating uphill. That trumps extra snowfall in that instance. In most case in the Alps the equilibrium line has gone so high that the glaciers are set to waste away.
Back to Moscow with its borderline semi-arid continental climate: they could well see enhanced moisture and enhanced temperature reshape the graph. A shorter duration of snowpack with fewer but proportionally heavier snowfalls..for a few decades.Then the effects of further warming would completely dominate snowfall potential and snowlying would be transient.
You misunderstand Nick. I’m not using cold weather to push global cooling, I’m poking fun at you guys seizing on to every anomaly as evidence for your beliefs.
Nick, I’d leave the troll alone. Eric’s just a poor pathetic nobody.
World met media release
http://www.wmo.int/pages/mediacentre/press_releases/pr_966_en.html
Where have we heard all this before
eric is a parrot of the monckton myths
The SKS letter
http://www.skepticalscience.com/latest-pre-bunked-denialist-letter-in-lieu-of-science.html
The temperature isn’t actually rising though, is it?
I know you guys are flailing around, trying to find excuses, with spurious claims of heat being swallowed by the ocean depths, Chinese particulates, or heat being absorbed by other phenomenon, but its more than a little embarrassing that the thermometers aren’t budging – especially in the light of the 2008 NOAA State of the Climate report I’ve quoted several times which suggests that this is inconsistent with projections.
So prediction time – when will all this alleged absorbed warming reappear? Because if it never reappears, it might as well not exist.
Ah Eric has found one sentence from one report 4 years ago to declare models falsified and temperatures are no longer rising. That is very weak even by your standards. Let’s see, since 1997 RSS is flat and the other three are rising. Who’s flailing about again? Rahmstorf et al 2012 looks at the the signals….Eric ducks.
warmest decade on record and this Monckton moron wants to claim cooling,
state of the climate 2011 http://www.climatewatch.noaa.gov/article/2012/state-of-the-climate-in-2011-highlights
indicators,
forgot, local sunshine coast daily had an editorial devoted to climate change,
Have noticed a complete reversal in the past few months since the god botherer editor left. this is the second piece this week advocating action to combat climate change.
we now get facts,
well done sunshine coast daily. .
Monckton is a sad joke.
We have a lot to thank Monckton for. He almost singlehandledly convinced the American Republicans that alarmists are mostly closet communists.
He convinced them of nothing they got him in because he was one of the few clowns that backed their own stupidity
The Republicans think that anyone who disagrees with them is a communist. So they are very vulnerable to unctuous charlatans like Monckton who can play them like violins.
noticed this bit from monckton designed to pull the suckers in
” Yet the least-squares linear-regression trend on the Hadley Centre/CRU dataset favoured by the IPCC indeed shows no statistically-significant warming for 16 years. ”
notice “favoured”
but the suckers read that as though the IPCC uses CRU.for global world temp
Hadley does not record the full global temp data, they only record arctic stns but assumae that the rest of the arctic is warming at the global rate,
GISS also does not record the total global temp but assumes that the arctic is only warming as fast as the nearest stns
The Arctic is the fastest warming area of the planet .
global warming does not reside in record years is resides in trends
even the CRU trend since 2000 is 0.13DegC
The warming continues, Monckton is a fool
In the letter they call themselves scientists, Monckton is forced by fact to now speak of researchers instead,
we use GISS monckton , get used to it http://www.nasa.gov/pdf/509796main_GISS_annual_temperature_anomalies_running.pdf
Although, at least this idiot can read a graph, he goes for the conspiracy theory reply
john byatt :
05 Dec 2012 8:36:15am
Please, can we get over this, no warming for fifteen years nonsense
the GISS graph does not reveal that
Click to access 509796main_GISS_annual_temperature_anomalies_running.pdf
,
Alert moderator
John :
05 Dec 2012 9:02:23am
john byatt, James E.Hansen of NASA/GISS has confessed that his data are smoothed and adjusted before release, but he will not, and has not been compelled to, tell us what his raw data show.
On the other hand, the UK Met Office, by dint of legal threat and threat of FOI request, HAS been forced to release unadulterated figures.
They prove that the globe has actually COOLED over the last 16 years.
Alert moderator
antichinus :
05 Dec 2012 9:26:11am
Cow excrement and flying pigs.
Data has to be adjusted, but not because it is being fudged!
Talking about clutching at any straw!
Alert moderator
I guess Hansen must have gotten some work done in between being arrested for climate activism.
At least Hansen does something productive Eric, unlike you desperately trolling this site. You sure have some mummy issues don’t you?
You mean Hansen fits in some work between being arrested?
Some people have principles Eric. Something you would know nothing about.
Did you watch the pacman frog video? Very you…
Better than the animal porn you like.
Hilarious – more climate delegates exposed as ignorant simpletons. I guess after 2 (3?) conferences of doing the dihydrogen monoxide joke, they were forewarned, so this time we tried something else.
Did you actually view that eric,?
eight interviewed originally, only six said they would wear the mask, how many days did they spend asking people to find those six? they were students and social science people
did you see the others snicker,
once again eric you have been scammed
Oh and there are a lot of others there only allowed to attend for three days each, students and social researchers, they are all gone before the serious discussions begin,
.
Notice the difference, this op ed from Hansen,
notice that he only uses James Hansen, does not try to convince by appeal to his own authority like that Fulks goose
I’d forgotten about that – Hansen’s hilarious call for an invasion of Canada “we have to do something to stop them”.
Right up there with his praise of dictatorship an an effective system for addressing climate issues. http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/01/18/hansen-would-rather-have-us-ruled-by-china/
You have been suckered in again , watts makes the allegation and links to michaels making the same allegation , no link to the Hansen piece at all,
If you want credibility link to Hansen piece and highlight the call for a dictatorship, also the highlight the call to invade Canada,
Do you understand that you are hallucinating and need medication?
Copy of the original page:-
Click to access 20101122_ChinaOpEd.pdf
There was a copy on the south china post website, where I read it a few years ago, but it seems to have disappeared after a website reorg.
Hansen emailed me a copy of that,
Now as I asked you which bits call for a dictatorship and the invasion of Canada ,?
post or reveal yourself as a liar
your call
Praise for China:-
Fossil fuel interests reign in Washington and other capitals. Big money forces legislatures to hatch ineffectual schemes such as “cap-and-trade-with-offsets”, a system designed by big banks.
Is there any hope, if most nations delude themselves with greenwash, of stopping rule by fossil fuel interests? Yes, China is the best hope. China now leads the world in clean energy investments – nuclear, wind, and solar power.
In other words, in Hansen’s world, western democracy has failed, because it has been bought by big oil, and only dictatorships like China can save the world.
And I already gave my quote for Hansen demanding America “do something” to stop Canada exploiting its tar sands. At the very least he’s advocating cultural imperialism – using America’s economic and global political might to put pressure on Canada.
John, you have exposed Eric for what he is – a pathetic sad liar, trolling in the hope of human contact. The psychopathology of this guy is very disturbing (especially his fixation on Nazism and Eugenics)
I’m surprised at you mocking the founders of the modern green movement rubber.
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100076404/why-do-i-call-them-eco-nazis-because-they-are-eco-nazis/
Dont forget to do a post on the breaking news about a global warming induced summer snowfall in Falls Creek.
http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/article/15554732/summer-snow-storm-at-falls-creek/
Don’t try to change the subject, post your quotes re Hansen, I will pursue this until you do, so get used to it.
where is Hansen’s call for a dictatorship and the invasion of canada
.
As I said above, Hansen praised the Chinese system as being our best hope, because Western democracy has failed (has been bought by big oil). He’s not explicitly saying “Western Democracy should be replaced by a Chinese dictatorship”, but he is saying that the Chinese dictatorship is better at addressing climate issues.
Given that Hansen thinks we’re all going to die unless we stop the death trains, that’s as close as you can get to calling for a dictatorship while being too much of a coward to actually say it.
Post the quotes from hansen where he calls for a dictatorship and calls to invade Canada, also post the 2008 Noaa quote that the global temp has not warmed for fifteen years
calling you eric,
Praise for China:-
Fossil fuel interests reign in Washington and other capitals. Big money forces legislatures to hatch ineffectual schemes such as “cap-and-trade-with-offsets”, a system designed by big banks.
Is there any hope, if most nations delude themselves with greenwash, of stopping rule by fossil fuel interests? Yes, China is the best hope. China now leads the world in clean energy investments – nuclear, wind, and solar power.
In other words, in Hansen’s world, western democracy has failed, because it has been bought by big oil, and only dictatorships like China can save the world.
And I already gave my quote for Hansen demanding America “do something” to stop Canada exploiting its tar sands. At the very least he’s advocating cultural imperialism – using America’s economic and global political might to put pressure on Canada.
No that is not a quote calling for a dictatorship, now put up the quote asked for or admit that you lied
I see – so in your bizarro world, claiming western democracy has failed because Washington has been bought by big oil, and that China is the hope for the world, is not the same calling for dictatorship to solve our problems?
Splitting hairs a little tonight, aren’t we John?
John, yep, Eric is a liar-denier.
And Hansen still believes western democracy has failed, and the main hope for the future is Chinese dictatorship.
Eric is jerking off to Judith Curry again…
Sexism too – she disagrees with you, so she’s subhuman in some way, and doesn’t deserve the normal respect you would give to a woman? The word you are looking for is “untermensch”.
It usually snows at least once or twice in most years in the OZ Alps in summer. I experienced an Xmas night fall in the 1970s.
While that cold front was squeezing in down south,northern NSW and much of Queensland was anomalously warm with several temperature records broken,including serious ones like consecutive number of degree days and the like .Mount Isa saw the November average maximum 2.6C degrees above average,13 days over 40C and the first four days of December have been over 40 as well. 95% of Queensland and NSW has been anomalously warm for November by one to four degrees celsius.
And you’ve found a dash of snow for one morning in NE Vic and the highest peaks of Australia…no comparison really.
with Mike’s indulgence, this is how it is going to be eric until you put up the three quotes,
long wwek that could be quickly sorted by you puting the quotes.
I posted the link for the Hansen “putting pressure on Canada” with my comment. Obviously I was being a little satirical, but Hansen is clearly suggesting America “must not let Canada” exploit the tar sands. An invasion is pretty much the only way America could achieve this.
I posted the link to the article where Hansen calls for the Chinese dictatorship to solve our problems.
FFS, Western democracy has failed, China is our hope for the future, is *not* a call for dictatorship?
No I do not want your satiracal interpretation I want the quote to put up as your evidence that hansens calls for an ivasion of canada, just put the quote itself up eric, it’s an easy
C’mon Eric the liar denier, put up or shut up.
I did.
Pants on Fire. No principles.
is this your quote of Hansen calling for a dictatorship?
“Yes, China is the best hope. China now leads the world in clean energy investments – nuclear, wind, and solar power.”
Okay most will work out that you have a bit of a comprehension problem with that one now the invasion of Canada one,
then we will put them all together
You’re forgetting the bit where Hansen disses Western democracy, suggesting its all been bought out by big oil.
So what is different about China?
Oh we need the NOAA one as well stating that there has been no warming for fifteen years
I already provided a quote from the MET office indicating temperatures have been flat for 15 years.
http://metofficenews.wordpress.com/2012/10/14/met-office-in-the-media-14-october-2012/
The linear trend from August 1997 (in the middle of an exceptionally strong El Nino) to August 2012 (coming at the tail end of a double-dip La Nina) is about 0.03°C/decade, amounting to a temperature increase of 0.05°C over that period, but equally we could calculate the linear trend from 1999, during the subsequent La Nina, and show a more substantial warming.
0.05c = flatline.
Its going to be amusing watching you guys squirm as the flatline continues. The next deadline is Ben Santer’s 17 year minimum significance for a climate trend.
OKay then I asked you to put up the three quotes,
No interpretation required, just the three quotes,
!…..
2…..
3…….
This is tiresome. I already explained in detail what I meant.
It is going to get more tiresome for you until you address your claims
Right, so the basis for your claim that temperatures have not gone up is that temperatures have gone up? Well, hey, half of WUWT’s commentariat thinks we’ve plunged into an ice age, so I guess you’re ahead of the curve.
According to alarmist theory, temperatures should have risen by about 0.3c.
The rise in temperature, if there actually has been a rise, is far less than 0.3c – even using GISS temperatures maintained by climate fanatic James Hansen (who has been arrested at least twice for climate activism, and has a long track record of hyped up predictions).
Put up or shut up Eric.
(your new name is now ‘pants on fire’)
Eric put them up and get it over with, you are just prolonging your agony
Like this eric
Hansens call for dictatorship
”
Hansens call to invade canada
”
Noaa stating that there has been no warming for fifteen years
“
No warming for 15 years.
http://metofficenews.wordpress.com/2012/10/14/met-office-in-the-media-14-october-2012/
The linear trend from August 1997 (in the middle of an exceptionally strong El Nino) to August 2012 (coming at the tail end of a double-dip La Nina) is about 0.03°C/decade, amounting to a temperature increase of 0.05°C over that period, but equally we could calculate the linear trend from 1999, during the subsequent La Nina, and show a more substantial warming.
0.05c = flatline.
You’ve just posted the METoffice’s explanation of how people like you can and do cherry pick a flat line [start from the strongest El Nino on record]. The irony is rich the real context of the statement completely eludes you. Amazing.
The MET office is desperately trying to explain the flatline as a series of unlikely coincidences. The irony escapes you.
I put them up, and explained what I meant.
You might not think that claiming western democracy has failed, and that China is our best hope, is praising dictatorship, but thats your problem.
I also provided a link with my comment – Canada, according to Hansen, must not be allowed to exploit her tar sands.
How does Hansen want America to stop Canada? Canada has already made it clear they plan to go ahead regardless of what America wants.
Now put the three quotes up , I am not interested in your interpretation, I am just interested in the three quotes,
http://metofficenews.wordpress.com/2012/10/14/met-office-in-the-media-14-october-2012/
The linear trend from August 1997 (in the middle of an exceptionally strong El Nino) to August 2012 (coming at the tail end of a double-dip La Nina) is about 0.03°C/decade, amounting to a temperature increase of 0.05°C over that period, but equally we could calculate the linear trend from 1999, during the subsequent La Nina, and show a more substantial warming.
0.05c = flatline.
Starting your cherry pick from an exceptionally high point …
… and ending it on an unusually low point …
… will not show much heating …
… but if you start your cherry pick at the same part of the oscillation as you end it, the heating trend will be much more apparent.
Sorry I couldn’t reduce it to words of one syllable, but I’m sure Eric still won’t get it.
The underlying assumption is the current flatline is a temporary anomaly, which will quickly be resolved as warming resumes.
What will your excuse be next year?
Told you he wouldn’t get it. The man’s a fool.
Better start working on next year’s excuse zoot.
WRONG!!!
There is no underlying assumption.
Try again.
Of course there is a set of assumptions. The MET office has advanced an explanation of why they think the flatline is consistent with alarmist theory.
I’m looking forward to next year’s excuses.
Yep,he did not get it at all. He will not be helped,rudely or politely!
Nick it is pretty obvious that you are miles ahead of us here re meteorology
couple of clicks and I found you, why not link you site,?
WRONG!!!</b.
The MET office was explaining how you can get a flat line by choosing your start and end points, just the way the people you copied did it.
How on earth did you write an app? You have absolutely no grasp of logical thinking. I can only assume the app is as crappy as your arguments here.
zoot, calm down dear, its only a blog discussion.
Lets look at the facts. We have a set of temperatures today, which are within spitting distance of the temperature in 1997.
The MET office believes this is because of a variety of short term anomalies, and suggests that underlying alarmist warming trends remain intact.
This desperation measure will buy them another year or two.
As I said, I’m looking forward to their excuses next year.
Oops!
Pants on Fire (eric)
Time for you to apologise to John. Your lies have been called out beautifully.
Wrong, I backed my points. You’re confusing a little satire with prevarication.
Pants, lies and evasion are your world. The perfect neofascist.
Hansen just gets funnier by the day. Canada must be stopped, and economic measures have failed. What next?
What Next?
Eric will grow a brain…or is it Eric the Half a Brain?
Ribbit.
Hansen praising dictatorship.
Click to access 20101122_ChinaOpEd.pdf
Fossil fuel interests reign in Washington and other capitals. Big money forces legislatures to hatch ineffectual schemes such as “cap-and-trade-with-offsets”, a system designed by big banks.
Is there any hope, if most nations delude themselves with greenwash, of stopping rule by fossil fuel interests? Yes, China is the best hope. China now leads the world in clean energy investments – nuclear, wind, and solar power.
Hansen saying “Canada must be stopped” from exploiting coal tar sands.
Erics alternate reality
Noaa staes that it has not warmed for fiteen years
Click to access 509796main_GISS_annual_temperature_anomalies_running.pdf
Hansen calls for a dictatorship
Fossil fuel interests reign in Washington and other capitals. Big money forces legislatures to hatch ineffectual schemes such as “cap-and-trade-with-offsets”, a system designed by big banks.
Is there any hope, if most nations delude themselves with greenwash, of stopping rule by fossil fuel interests? Yes, China is the best hope. China now leads the world in clean energy investments – nuclear, wind, and solar power.
Hansen calls to invade canada
President Obama has the power not only to deny tar sands oil additional access to Gulf Coast refining, which Canada desires in part for export markets, but also to encourage economic incentives to leave tar sands and other dirty fuels in the ground.
NOAA uses the GHCN which uses GISS, which shows the warming continuing,
Eric thinks that they should use the data which he selects
case closed eric
you are out of touch with reality
1. If GISS and NOAA temperatures differ to that degree, which it seems they do, then the error margin for global temperatures means current trends are indistinguishable from a flatline.
http://www.woodfortrees.org/plot/gistemp/from:1997/trend/plot/hadcrut4gl/from:1997/trend
Either that or one of the series is wrong.
2. Fossil fuel interests rule Washington and other capitals … China is the best hope.
Only the purity of dictatorship can fend off big oil? Or did he mean something else? Interested in your take John.
3. resident Obama has the power not only to deny tar sands oil additional access to Gulf Coast refining, which Canada desires in part for export markets, but also to encourage economic incentives to leave tar sands and other dirty fuels in the ground.
Hansen is advocating America bully Canada into changing policy. What if economic incentives fail (as they clearly are – if Obama vetoes Keystone, Canada has already said they’ll just step up sales to China)? What is the next move?
Hansen is advocating America bully Canada into changing policy. What if economic incentives fail (as they clearly are – if Obama vetoes Keystone, Canada has already said they’ll just step up sales to China)? What is the next move?
you have just crossed the line, I will not comment with you further
why
“President Obama has the power not only to deny tar sands oil additional access to Gulf Coast refining, which Canada desires in part for export markets, but also to encourage economic incentives to leave tar sands and other dirty fuels in the ground.”
You continually show yourself to be mentally deficient .
I suffer the fool no longer
President Obama has the power not only to deny tar sands oil additional access to Gulf Coast refining, which Canada desires in part for export markets, but also to encourage economic incentives to leave tar sands and other dirty fuels in the ground.
On what planet is that not bullying? You might believe it justified, but it is still advocacy of coercion to try to force Canada to change their policy.
Eric, you are just a lying sack of $hit
I see – so applying economic pressure on another country is not bullying, because the cause is just.
The more than 500 dead or missing in Bopha was still below the 1,200 deaths from tropical storm Washi, which hit in December 2011, leaving hundreds of thousands homeless in Mindanao, he said.
Aquino said the government was investigating why an army patrol base in New Bataan, which was washed away in the flash floods, had been located in a flood-prone area.
Officials were also checking reports that an evacuation centre there was among the structures wiped out in the floods, the president added.
“According to (survivors), there is a small lake on the mountain that gave way so the waters flowed down, not just along the rivers… but all across, like a waterfall, bringing a slurry that covered the whole town,” Roxas said.
One shelter there had caved in during the typhoon, forcing the people inside to flee to an even smaller building, he said.
Bopha was the most powerful of the 16 storms to pummel the Philippines this year, though Mindanao is not usually on the front line.
Regional military spokesman Lieutenant Colonel Paniza said three soldiers taking part in rescue operations were killed in New Bataan, with eight others from the same unit among the missing.
“It is quite sad and tragic. They were actually there to be ready to help our countrymen who may be in trouble,” Roxas said.
Worse than thought – tragic.
Imagine QLD getting 16 cyclones in one year, Apart from the deaths the state would be bankrupt,
Of course the deniers do not relate to these disasters, it is someone else suffering,
If it is not happening in Australia then it can be ignored,
If only the Philippines had switched to low energy light bulbs, and installed more solar cells – none of this would have happened!
Pants on Fire Eric thinks it is funny that people are dying in the Philippines. How low as a person do you have to sink to laugh at people who are dying? As you have a fixation on Nazism and Eugenics I suppose I should not be surprised about you hatred of humanity.
Stop mocking one of the architects of the modern Green fixation on CO2, the Austrian NAZI Gunther Schwab.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Günther_Schwab
johnathon green article on the Drums,
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-12-06/green-how-can-anything-rival-the-threat-of-climate-change/4410172
Hilarious – your doomsday cult is suffering from large numbers of people paying it lip service.
Just as in religious societies, a lot of people got to church on Sunday because its the custom, rather than a burning desire to listen to the priest and think about God, so in our society people now give perfunctory genuflection to tales of future climate disaster, but don’t care enough to change their lives, or demand real action.
What other explanation can you have, for surveys in which a lot of people say they are worried, but elections in which other issues take priority?
If I truly, in my heart, thought the world would end next Friday unless I did something, I would do something. But people aren’t “doing something” – they don’t really care.
Got a question that you guys might be able to answer.
Given that China is now, by far, the largest CO2 emitter in the world, and at just under 10% increase p/a is contributing the lions share of human CO2 emissions growth,
When are you guys going to stage an “occupy China” protest?
Well we couldn’t “Occupy China” – I suspect the Chinese would see that as an act or war and respond accordingly.
But yes it is true, China is one of the world’s largest emitters.
In my view, the United States and China need to come to an agreement. However the perceived national self interest of both these nations won’t allow that (at this stage at least).
It is a version of the prisoners dilemma.
For once we agree about something 🙂
It most certainly is a form of prisoner’s dilemma. Any economy which tries to unilaterally limit carbon emissions, by raising domestic energy prices, is committing economic suicide – competitors can relax, and rely on their lower structural costs to push the carbon limiting economy out of the market.
This is being demonstrated in a dramatic fashion by the implosion of the European economy. They really do believe – the BBC and other national broadcasters have been relentlessly broadcasting alarmism to the public for decades, and now Europe is paying the price. http://www.spiegel.de/international/business/merkel-s-switch-to-renewables-rising-energy-prices-endanger-german-industry-a-816669.html
The only “solution” which could possibly allow a country to unilaterally decarbonise, without a dramatic increase in energy costs, is nuclear power. Renewables are an expensive waste of time. And even nuclear might cost too much – from memory nuclear power costs about twice as much as electricity generated from fracked gas.
“When are you guys going to stage an “occupy China” protest?”
When you stop telling lies Eric.
You’re not going to protest against China, because you only go for soft targets and easy wins. Or maybe because Hansen thinks they are cool, despite the fact they now contribute the lions share of CO2 output and CO2 output growth.
More lies and evasion, Pants. The only easy target is you (gamma ray aliens, you are a hoot!)
Noones going to stage an “occupy China” protest, because it would end in a nasty prison cell at the pleasure of the Chinese dictatorship.
China are a little tougher than going after a few bankers – easier to go for the soft targets.
Soft targets like climate scientists? Your neofascist goon mates have been threatening scientists for years now. Big brave Eric, his mates sending death threats to scientists. Well done champ. Your kids would be sooo proud.
People get excited when they discover they’ve been fed a pack of lies. Climategate was very revealing.
When morons like you invest so much time in those emails it just shows how desperate you are to ignore reality. Back you your animal porn and alien gamma ray communications…
Hidden any declines lately rubber?
What do your alien gamma ray overlords tell you Pants…to post here where everybody thinks you re a first class wanker? You must be a really sad and lonely denier. And let me know who you are working for at the moment. I’d love to have a chat to them about your antics.
Threatening my job now rubber? So – sexist remarks against Judith Curry, personal attacks on me. Who is behaving like a fascist now?
Remember the headline that the US had reduced GHG emissions,
It was crap
http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2012/12/05/1275811/why-claims-about-reductions-of-us-carbon-dioxide-emissions-are-misleading/
I was wondering when you would notice the methane losses from the switch to the gas economy. Maybe you’d be better off encouraging them to burn coal.
In any case, my experience in England shows that, as energy costs rise, due to enforced green tariffs or whatever, people switch en masse to burning coal at home.
You didn’t (according to you), largely because you were paying four times the going price for a sack of coal.
Its easy to laugh at Europeans, caught between freezing winters and their mistaken belief in dangerous climate change. But your fellow travellers should take some of the blame – if Europeans had not listened to climate alarmists, they wouldn’t be in their current pickle.
Who’s laughing??
zoot, Eric’s hatred of humanity is pretty sad.
Not to sure that Doha is being reported correctly in some media,
This in the AGE
http://www.theage.com.au/environment/climate-change/big-shift-seen-in-us-position-at-doha-climate-talks-20121206-2awmw.html
almost exactly the opposite spin in others
Its just posturing. The US has a blowout budget deficit and a total debt of $16 trillion and rising. They simply cannot afford any form of transfer payments beyond a little window dressing. Obama just wants the Republicans to be the bad guys, by letting the Republican Congress kill any agreement.
Or maybe he plans to run the printing presses, and print the money he plans to ship overseas?
have often been directed to Spiegel by the deniers for some anti renewable propaganda
is this newspaper the “murdoch” press of europe
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/obama-disappoints-expectations-of-climate-change-action-at-doha-summit-a-871193.html
exact opposite take
I guess we’ll know after the dust settles.
Ali G does it again
Monckton makes one interesting point – any defendant in a case brought against them due to a law signed by Obama, now or in the future, could conceivably challenge the legitimacy of the law, by asserting Obama’s presidency is illegitimate, and demand to inspect the president’s original birth certificate.
john, that one is gold. Monkton, Bolt, Plimer, Eric…’tardsville…
Useful project
witness king tides
http://witnesskingtides.org/